Israel’s prime minister sounds upbeat, even if no one else does

Vladek2 wrote: "Abbas wants nothing more than the UN resolution that demands the restoration of the Palestine that existed prior to the 1967 Israeli invasion and occupation."

Once again, basic history: No 'Palestine' ever existed prior to 1967; After the Arabs, including the forbearers of todays 'Palestinians' REJECTED the UN's partition plan in 1948 and REJECTED the idea of an independent 'Palestinian' state, those lands were divided between Jordan and Egypt. In 1967 the Arabs again tried to destroy Israel, failed utterly, and Egypt and Jordan lost those lands that are now known as the Gaza strip and the West Bank to Israel. Israel offered to trade the land back to Egypt and Jordan for nothing more than peace - and was REJECTED. Israel has since made a plethora of offers and actions to form a new state of 'Palestine' in these lands and, time after time, has been REJECTED.

If the Arabs want peace, they should stop fabricating stories of an imaginary previous state of Palestine, which never existed, and just ACCEPT Israel and peace.

Abbas wants nothing more than the UN resolution that demands the restoration of the Palestine that existed prior to the 1967 Israeli invasion and occupation. He wants a viable, cohesive, governable Palestine free from threat of Jewish settler or Israeli military attacks on Palestinians. This would be a Palestine that is not intersected by a web of Israeli settlements interconnected by highways for exclusive use of Israelis. Abbas cannot afford to have Palestine become another Gaza ghetto surrounded by Israeli military blockading critical food, medical supplies and construction materials.

Netanyahu has yet to offer a vision or a plan. He continues to pander to Jewish zealots that want free Palestinian land as a God-given right. He has yet to demonstrate courageous leadership to initiate agreements based on justice that would be a foundation for an enduring peace. Netanyahu owes too much to his conservative coalition that is prepared for years of war, occupation and suppression of Palestinians.

However peace cannot come unless the Palestinians believe they have been treated with justice. Generations of Palestinians have occupied this land for at least a millinium while the Jews have left it and reestablished themselves throughout the world. Although the German Nazis prompted the massacre of Jews while Western nations practiced apathy, it was not the Palestinians that contributed to that debacle. Therefore the Palestinians do not believe they should sacrifice their homes, farms and livelihoods for the sins of the Western world towards Jews.

The USA has funded Israel with $6.0 billion annually. Through its tax policies, the USA has encouraged private Jewish donors to contribute funds to build and expand Jewish settlements on Palestinian land. Through the occupation, Israel has collected taxes from Palestinians to strengthen Israeli infrastructure for the Jewish settlers. There has been extensive economic injustice imposed by Israel and the USA on the Palestinians.

It is time to establish a free, unoccupied, contiguous, viable, governable Palestine. There cannot be the threat of settler or Israeli violence against Palestine. There is a need to build Palestinian governmental institutions, infrastructure and a prosperous economy. Both the USA and Israel can and should take responsibility to fund this development of a new, free Palestine. A prosperous people with the freedom to travel and express themselves is the strongest foundation for an enduring peace.

It is not too late for real peace. However it takes courage, money, tolerance, communication and partnership. I hope we can avoid another photo opportunity tjhat serves the politicians but punished the people. The USA has the economic clout, previously used by Carter, Reagan and Bush Senior, to force Israel into good faith negotiations. Obama should be prepared to use that clout.

"Abbas wants nothing more than the UN resolution that demands the restoration of the Palestine that existed prior to the 1967 Israeli invasion and occupation." ???

Why not mention the 1947 UN resolution that made Israel a Jewish State, and the Arab countries refused to accept an Arab State? or the League of Nation that designated all the land west of the Jordan River as a Jewish State (and gave the land east of the Jordan to form the Arab Kingdom of Trans-Jordan.

There was no "Palestine" before 1967, it was the West Bank of the Kingdom of Jordan.

There was no Arab control of Palestine in the last six centuries, as Palestine was part of the Ottoman Empire, Turkish, not Arab, rulers.

The Jewish population, and the Jewish immigrant since the 19th century, had the same citizen rights as the Arab immigrants that came to from the neighboring parts of the Empire to share the better living conditions.

Thus the Arabs never ruled Palestine, so there is nothing to “recover”. However, if they succeed, all the Jewish population will be annihilated – not in death camps, but slaughters in there homes and street by Arab mobs. This is what the Hamas, and Palestinian Authority, teach their children in their schools and children TV shows.

If Israel keeps all occupied territories, either it throws democracy out of the window, adopts apartheid and remains a Jewish state, or it remains a democracy and faces a majority of non-jews as its citizens, with all the electoral and political consequences.

The peace talks got off with a sensitive issue, the killing of innocent civilians. But hey, they were Jewish right? Now, lets turn the socks inside out and imagine the smell if it were Palestinians who were murdered. What would happen to the peace talks?
Can Abbas really reign in the terrorists, and provide Israel with security against attacks? Lets not be so naive. Even if Israel gave the Palestinians all of Israel, this would not be the end.This is a cultural phenomenon. Hatred against Jews is hard wired. It would take generations of educating young children to alter the bad genes.
Basically, anti-semites have always existed, Jews have had to take the heat for whatever had happened,in the world. For anyone who is anti-Israel, ( but of course not an anti-semite)it is expected that Israel appease, placate, turn the other cheek, give up and accommodate it's sworn enemies.
Yes, Hammas will become pacifists! Yes, and hyenas are vegetarians. I wonder whether Obama has any intentions of returning the US., back to the Indians?

there will be no peace as long as AiPAC and all the other israeli lobbies want war. florida has alot of electoral college votes. obama will not risk losing all those votes for peace. why should he... hes already got a nobel

Vladek and his likes know only too well the basic historical facts so concisely laid out by Gurpenname and Nudnik... but what are the facts when they get into the way of their agenda? They'll continue to repeat ad nauseum all the well known rubbish about pre-1967, "cohesive" Palestine and return of 1948's Arab refugees, of which couple of hundreds are maybe still alive... ah, wait - several generations of their profuse brood somehow pretend to be refugees, too.

The Economist bias is also obvious: Bibi is “reluctant”, it is not clear if he is sincere, to prove himself to TE and the rest of the lefty Israel bashing crowd he should drop his coalition member and ally Lieberman, and so on and so forth. However, the terms of peace suggested by Netanyahu “accepted by most foreign countries” - and not a word about the other side's in negotiations reaction to them. Everything they need to prove they're good lads is to continue emit some - preferably illegible - sounds.

Well, Palestinians have just demonstrated their good faith murdering four and wounding two of the fellow negotiators' side... but the article mentions this en passant, after all it was not a busload of Jooos, right?

I wish President Obama and Secretary Clinton all the very best with this latest attempt to achieve a peace settlement between the Palestinians and the Israelis. However, I am not sanguine that they will do any better than past Administrations. This conflict has defeated US Presidents since Harry Truman and continues to burn away in the Middle East as a major source of tension.

The challenge they face is that for a meaningful peace settlement to take place there must be a negotiated agreement that allows both sides a fair outcome that they can sell to their respective populations. Unfortunately the balance of power between the two protagonists is so unfair that the starting point is a problem in itself.

Sadat and Begin achieved a settlement at a time when Egypt had succeeded in launching a major military assault on Israel during the Yom Kippur War. Although Israel managed to respond and seize positions across the canal into Egypt, the balance of power was much more even between the two nation states. Surrendering the Sinai desert back to Egypt in return for securing Israel’s southern flank was a sensible deal.

The peace settlement between Egypt and Israel was a cause of much more trouble for Sadat who subsequently lost his life in a terror attack led by members of his own Army. It also gave a strong impetus to the Muslim Brotherhood and the radical Islamic force in Egypt. These forces then waged a nasty campaign during much of the 1980s that has been subdue but has not totally disappeared. Once President Mubarak (aged 82) dies, the future direction for Egypt may change.

In its negations with the Palestinians Israel starts from a position of total military and economic dominance, plus a politically dominant position due to the divisions in the Palestinian ranks, and the unwavering support it enjoys from the USA. Israel sees itself as essentially having won and has previously made it clear that it will not tolerate a sovereign Palestinian state. It has previously sought to deny the Palestinians the right to an independent military or even the freedom to travel and trade unrestricted as would be the right of any sovereign state. It will seek to block any influence from say Iran or similar regional power, to provide military support to a Palestinian state, while happily taking military support from the United States for itself.

The issue of the settlement building may be an early deal breaker. Netanyahu’s government is a weak coalition which needs the support of the more radical right wing settler parties. Why would they agree to stop building when they see it as a god given right to reclaim the Jewish homeland?

For the Palestinians the starting point is a position of weakness. They remain divided and Hamas has already sought to scupper the process with its attacks on Jewish settlers in the West Bank. Abbas cannot control Hamas and essentially cannot speak on behalf of all Palestinians. If he is not able to secure an agreement that leaves the Palestinians with sufficient control over land, water, sovereign state rights to military, diplomatic and international trade, plus a solution to bring the Gaza out from its existence as a massive concentration camp where the inmates have guns, he fails. He is likely to end up like Sadat if he strikes a deal that he cannot sell to the radicals in the Hamas movement.

Finally, there is a question mark over the role that the US will play. To his credit Obama has started this peace process relatively early in his Administration. This compares to say Clinton who did it in the dying days of his two terms in office, or G.W. Bush who was never seen as a credible or honest broker in the first place. However, what can Obama do or offer that will make Israel feel that it actually needs to negotiate in good faith? The US gives Israel a massive amount of financial support. It also provides Israel with significant military and intelligence resources. To be fair there is a flow back to the US from Israel on the last two fronts, but it would seem that the key bargaining lever for the US to pull is the level of support it gives to Israel. Would Obama be willing to take on the American Jewish lobby and the right wing conservative media and pressure Israel in order to secure a genuine peace agreement?

Given that racial antisemitism was invented in Vienna, that Hitler and Eichmann and almost all of Eichmann's staff were Austrians, that an absurd disproportion of those running and staffing death camps were also Austrian, and finally, that Vienna had been the most recent flowering of Jewish accomplishment, Austria ought to have been the Jewish homeland. So many Germans were forced to flee Eastern Europe; why not a few more ?The "First Victim" pose has always been outrageous. Don't be fooled by the Sound of Music. After the Anschluss, Goering said concerning persecution of Jews, "The Austrians have accomplished more in five months than we have in five years." They were the most enthusiastic Nazis in Europe.
By going to Palestine, the Zionists gave the Christian Europeans exactly what they wanted; fewer Jews in Europe and a Jewish run landing strip in the Holy Land, so Jesus has the appropriate biblical place to land when he wants to come home. The world did not need a Jewish confessional state in a position to discredit Arab secularism, and set off OPEC and Islamic Fundamentalism.

"Mr Netanyahu said that he sought a peace that would “end the conflict” with the Palestinians “once and for all.”

He should also add the real motive that Israel has always had and followed fervently so far "We will take whole of Palestine through destroying them also once and for all and settling on all the land now in their hands."

I am a settler.
Here are my salient points:
All sides must remember that the World ordained partition.
We Israeli have to learn that non acceptance by the Arabs did not alter our agreement with the World Community. We did not gain privileges because of Arab intransigence. We are beholden to wait not manipulate.
Mistakes can be corrected and should not be punished. One refugee problem cannot be solved by creating another.
The land has to be re- partitioned sensibly, agreeably and equitably.
The partition must be base on demographic considerations only.
In both states there must be a majority and a respected and protected minority. Neither can be free of the other.
In both states their citizens must accept the laws and nature of the state or remove themselves to the 'other state'.
The land of Israel AKA Palestine is indivisible but eminently sharable. It has to be shared by two states not divided by them.
The states must realize that they have more factors in common than those that divide them. Economy, security, religious sites and to a lesser extent foreign policy
The 'sharing' cannot be equal in all things. Thus Israel is beholden to dedicate her economic strength to rehabilitate that of the nascent Palestinian State. Israel's security fears should be given a 'weighted' consideration.
Both governments must enter into a state of cooperation whereby the others strengths are an asset and not a threat. At the end of the day both states need a sovereign partner who speaks in the name of its people and can deliver. Neither state should try and shape the will or representation of the other but accepted it as a given.
Finally, Jerusalem is part of the land of Israel. As such she must be shared.
Shared and never divided.
In Jerusalem as in the two future states 'when the borders are open it matters not where they are'.
In short we must define and prioritize, the land, the states, the peoples and the religions.
Above all we must share a common respect and compassion for our fellows suffering. We have been equal partners in causing them.
We are equal partners in repairing that suffering and sharing our future successes and joys as one.
I want to thank your government for its unceasing efforts.

Peace talks??!! Who's kiddin' who? How stupidly naive & gullible can we get??

Wake me up when the circus is over..

The peace discussions"began under bad auspices:an influence "spiritual leader" rabid rabbi Ovadia Josef showed what have to be done:a final solution for the Palestinians who "all have to perish".This "solution" is in fact accepted by the most of Israel population,the rabbi being a "respected" figure in Israel politic scene and some days before the enraged rabbi spilled his rage a young woman Eden Abragil put her pictures with Palestinians with cuffed hands and covers eyes from the time when she had a "perfect life"as a soldier and she noted that she is ready to keep her "perfect life"as a Zionist even killing every Palestinian.Aluf Benn ,the notorious Haaretz journalist confessed that he ,and everyone else cuffed the hands of Arab prisoners and they remained such even when they ate and ,of course,imbued with urine and feces.In this atmosphere came the killing of four settlers from Hebron and i think that the killing could be explained fairer regarding whole the picture of "the conflict" instead to see it as an usual trying of "terrorists" to sabotage the peace process.About Clinton's parameters have to remind that even Shlomo Ben Ami,then Israeli foreign minister and participant at Camp David ,said that he also would reject the proposals if he were Arafat.

When US breastfeeded Haganah’s soul baby Israel with nuclear capacity. When Israel was protected to join TPT. When democratic United States of America refused to acknowledge democratic Palestinian election results. When you thrown out Goldstein Report on Gaza. When creeping genocide of Palestinian’s soil and soul committed by Israel. When psychonazi meet the soul of protocol zion... we clearly see complete outlook of the end of the negotiation tunnel. Global hardship.

Ooops - "Vienna had seen", not "been"

Peace talks: Had talked, continues to talk, will again talk.

Could there be an end to all these blank talks?

Stop talking please, do something tangible instead.
(btt1943)

World Force would be fully unrespectful and do actions needed to Palestinians or Israelis or anyone which throws out humanitarian values, occupies land and soil illegally, destroys Geneva Convention principles, manipulates the word of "terrorism" to kill innocent people, commits giant-lies in diplomacy to legitimate modern war, and laughs behind false flags of peace determination.

Interesting analysis in the article of how Netanyahu may be trying to make this politically possible. Hey, expectations are so low, maybe this is a good time for some change.

Also interesting in the comments how much emotion and feelings of bias there are on both sides, which is likely a sliver of what the negotiators on both sides are coming in with.

On the other hand, things have been relatively quiet in the West Bank, so here's hoping...

The direct peace 'negotiations' launched this week in Washington between Mahmoud Abbas President of the Palestinian Authority in Ramallah and Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu did not need the shooting operation that targeted illegal Israeli settlers near Hebron to aggravate or derail it. It originally failed or was doomed to fail before it began, unless the Palestinian side completely bowed to Netanyahu's terms under full American and Arab pressure, and this is not unlikely in any case.

The Palestinians do not only live in Ramallah. Where are the representatives of the Palestinians in the West Bank, including Jerusalem, Gaza, and Diaspora and inside historical Palestine? The current 'negotiating' team does not represent all Palestinians. Therefore, those so called negotiations will be worthless, like what happened to the Oslo accords, which were stopped by Benjamin Netanyahu in 2001, with his Ofra accord. For meaningful final negotiations to begin all sides should be represented. Peace is made with enemies, not friends.

If Israel is serious about those negotiations then it should stop the illegal settlements and any atrocities against the native Palestinians.

Let's see how much the US is serious in playing the roll of fair peace broker.

Hmm, looks like Abbas didn't have much of a choice than to attend as the US has now threatened to withdraw political support of the PA(threatening their already dire financial situation) unless he did as well as exerting pressure through various Arab countries in the area.

He has no mandate to act for the palestinian arabs except to refuse Netanyhu's demands, which is likely anyway as Netanyhu has already refused to stop building settlements and has demanded the palestinian's recognition of "the Jewish character" of the state of Israel as a pre-condition of talks. The sheer fact that Abbas has been pressured to attend despite Israel refusing to recognise even the most basic and reasonable of demands shows these talks as the mockery they are.

All this excercise will accomplish is to give the Israeli Jewish the ability to crow about their "wish to resolve the conflict" after the palestinians reject these negotiations.